Need your Input ...

[Nevervana]

I am coordinating the sale of my own BMW back to Philippe at his dealership, allowing them to certify it, and then purchase it as a pre-owned certified BMW immediately afterwards. This will take my payment from $1500 a month down to $900 a month, as there is a special going on for certified, preowned 6ers.

All was well for several weeks, until I started thinking about some things Philippe said to me.

He had mentioned that it was going to "cost me" $2500 to certify the BMW and that he would roll that cost into the loan total. He also told me that anything they find wrong with it - - anything needing repair - would be at my own expense. And he said anything. Transmission, tires, steering, computer.... anything. In fact he began to sound downright concerned as he thought about it, which put me on edge.

At first I thought "Huh, okay, oh well, bummer", but now .... now that I think about it a little more .... i don't get that at all.

Here's why:

If I sold them my car and walked away, they would pay for the certification and any repairs needed. They wouldn't tell me I have to pay $2500 plus repairs. I'd be gone. Out the door.

So why am I having to pay for the certification process at all? And why am I having to pay for any repairs it needs?

I understand this is a slightly different situation. He knows I plan to immediately purchase the car again. But technically, that is irrelevant. The promotion doesnt say "You have pay for the certification and pay for all repairs in order to get the special interest rate".

You guys told me Philippe was a really upstanding guy in his dealings, but this implies to me that he's trying to pass on BMW costs to me, and that kind of bothers me. Can someone correct my misconceptions, if any?

Thanks

[BHR4CE1]

You guys told me Philippe was a really upstanding guy in his dealings, but this implies to me that he's trying to pass on BMW costs to me, and that kind of bothers me. Can someone correct my misconceptions, if any?

Thanks

I have never purchased a car from him, but from what I know of Philippe, he is an upstanding guy...as well as the "shoot from the hip" type.

It is those of his qualities that make me believe HE is the one you should voice your concerns to.

[BHR4CE1]

In fact he began to sound downright concerned as he thought about it

Perhaps he had seen your thread here about the little mishap you had and that worried him?

[InsidiousSpeed]

He suggested a $900 price without checking your car (yet), assuming it is of reasonably good condition. Is this a fair assumption? If so, then any "surprises" they might find by way of faults etc. would cost you. That's his deal.

The promotion, like all promotions, is to lure you in first.

[NoM6D]

In the spirit of nick changes everywhere, I suggest "Neverending". :lool:

If you're satisfied with the condition of your car, perhaps you should consider auto finance at a credit union to lower your payment, as others have suggested before. Why bother with the CPO process? It makes complete sense that if BMW is providing some type of warranty extension to you as a result of CPO process, they would require any defects to be repaired first - otherwise they'd have to pay for these repairs if/when they became warranty issues. You have to realize two things, imo: First, if they bought the car back from you (regardless of whether you were going to immediately buy it back), they would lower the amount they paid you to account for any repairs necessary. Second, the market for cars has changed dramatically since your first post on this issue some months ago. I was offered $17k for my 2004 645 with 48k miles on it a couple of weeks ago by CarMax, and $23k at a BMW dealer in October. I had no reason to believe those numbers would go up later, so I bit the bullet and sold my car privately.

My final suggestion for you might be similar to advice I've offered before: Find the best deal you can on an '08 and take advantage of financing offers. If you do that this weekend, you may still qualify for year-end incentives that are not public knowledge. You will have warranty and possibly maintenance covered for some period of time. I'm sure there will be other deals as time goes on, but I recently had a good experience with a dealer and I suspect you will get one, too, if you shop around.

[bdaw]

I thought commencer was Lord Never Satisfied. :greenlaff:

If it's the Philippe that I know, he's a great guy, serious, and concerned about making a deal that makes sense for his clients as well an himself. It's hard to sell a deal on a used 650 for more than a new M6 went for just a few weeks ago.

I understand wanting a great deal and looking for it, but like the purchase of any production product. There is always going to be a risk of a better deal showing up afterwards. What you have to settle for yourself is what is a good deal for you. You seem to like the idea keeping your car regardless of the new prices, but only you are going to have to sell the deal to yourself and wake up in the morning and answer to yourself after the deal is done.

That being said, I'm more than willing to talk to Philippe and run over the deal with him if it helps, but seriously I will probably end up agreeing with him. He knows how to contact me.

When Philippe got concerned about the car possibly needing repair, it doesn't surprise me, he is looking out for the best interest for both of you and could see the deal a total waste of time if it needs $10,000 of work after you've already started to execute the deal. This is why a new car might make more sense. What ever you do, you are the one who is going to have to pull the trigger and live with the decision.

[boxboss]

I am coordinating the sale of my own BMW back to Philippe at his dealership, allowing them to certify it, and then purchase it as a pre-owned certified BMW immediately afterwards. This will take my payment from $1500 a month down to $900 a month, as there is a special going on for certified, preowned 6ers.
Never, I thought your current 6er is a lease? How can you "sell" a leased car to his dealership?

I think Phillipe is being straight up. If the car is in need of significant repair to make it a CPO in order for you to get the deal, why should they pay for it? There are loads of 650's coming off lease that will need very little to become CPO's...why wouldn't the dealer sell one of those rather than put a bunch of money into yours and try and sell it for the same price as one that didn't need all that. Your request that the car be a CPO is the reason for the expense and that is why you should pay for it.

It sounds like you have worked a very convoluted deal to buy a car that can't be worth more than $35k. Listen to me Never, YOU ARE WASTING MONEY!! This is perhaps the worst scenario I could imagine for your driving a 6. Why in the world would you pay $900/month to buy a used car when you can lease a brand new 08 for $854/month (before looking for deals?) Do you realize you could have leased a new 08 M6 vert for $799/month only 3 weeks ago?

This is the third time in 3 months that you have asked us for advice about buying/leasing a car. Each time, despite sound advice, you have dismissed what we say and continue on a path that seems hell-bent on keeping your current car - damn the torpedos, full speed ahead! There has to be a reason for this! What is it about your current car or your situation that you aren't telling us? Nobody in their right mind would make the deal you are considering in the current market.

[bdaw]

Never, I thought your current 6er is a lease? How can you "sell" a leased car to his dealership?

I think Phillipe is being straight up. If the car is in need of significant repair to make it a CPO in order for you to get the deal, why should they pay for it? There are loads of 650's coming off lease that will need very little to become CPO's...why wouldn't the dealer sell one of those rather than put a bunch of money into yours and try and sell it for the same price as one that didn't need all that. Your request that the car be a CPO is the reason for the expense and that is why you should pay for it.

It sounds like you have worked a very convoluted deal to buy a car that can't be worth more than $35k. Listen to me Never, YOU ARE WASTING MONEY!! This is perhaps the worst scenario I could imagine for your driving a 6. Why in the world would you pay $900/month to buy a used car when you can lease a brand new 08 for $854/month (before looking for deals?) Do you realize you could have leased a new 08 M6 vert for $799/month only 3 weeks ago?

This is the third time in 3 months that you have asked us for advice about buying/leasing a car. Each time, despite sound advice, you have dismissed what we say and continue on a path that seems hell-bent on keeping your current car - damn the torpedos, full speed ahead! There has to be a reason for this! What is it about your current car or your situation that you aren't telling us? Nobody in their right mind would make the deal you are considering in the current market.

Oh snap! :thumb:

[Nevervana]

I have never purchased a car from him, but from what I know of Philippe, he is an upstanding guy...as well as the "shoot from the hip" type.

It is those of his qualities that make me believe HE is the one you should voice your concerns to.

Or... I can come to a forum and get other peoples input, which is the entire point of this site.

[Nevervana]

I am at the end of my lease. I have the option to convert to loan, which is what I'm doing.

Yes. I do love my car. No. I have no desire to get an 08 right now. If anything, I want an 09. I've explained this numerous times. It's funny box that you try to nail me for "rejecting" your advice, and make several off color comments, but you can't even remember the basics of my situation. You really should refrain from telling me I'm "out of my mind" (and getting childish thumbs up from others) when you can't remember the situation accurately. Let's exchange information without the feminine bickering, yea?

I have thanked everyone for the input I've received numerous times.

Regarding your comment that I should pay simply because I'm requesting certification, I don't know if I totally agree with that. I explained why already, in my first post above.

Thanks

[bdaw]

To everyone: I came here to ask a question. I would appreciate it if someone could actually answer it, without all the snide comments, insults, and put downs. I asked a simple question. If you don't know the answer, don't comment.

Box and the rest of you: this situation has evolved 10 times based on helpful input I've gotten from people here. I have thanked people for the help numerous times. So I don't know what the problem is.

I am at the end of my lease. I have the option to convert to loan, which is what I'm doing. My simple question, again, is: does it make sense that I foot the bill for the certification and all repairs in a situation like this?

If someone answered this question directly at some point above, please repeat it. I stopped reading after seeing all the useless off-color unrelated commentary (paragraphs of it). Try to remember guys: we are men. Not a bunch of grudge holding, bickering women. I am here to exchange information with others. Not argue.

Thanks


Once you convert from a lease to a loan through the dealership, they take on certain responsibilities to back up the CPO status. It is up to the dealership to make a choice on weather they want to CPO a vehicle or not. In this scenario, you are the one making the choice to CPO the vehicle to get the benefit of the rates/service. As mentioned before, if you want to go to the credit union, get your own loan and buy it from BMW then you should if you are worried about the condition of the car.

Also, the point has been made many many times over, get a new lease at those prices.

[Nevervana]

Bdaw - thank you for the first helpful response in this thread. Actually addressing the question and sans any snarky commentary.

I see what you're saying and understand. Thanks.

[Nevervana]

Also, the point has been made many many times over, get a new lease at those prices.
I've seen this point made. Many times. I have also responded to it many times. I will do so again, if only to save boxboss a few more moments of frustration and high blood pressure:

I do not want an 08. For many reasons already explained, ad nauseum:

1) There are currently no 08's available that match my desired color and options. I would be stuck with what is on the lot, or nearby. I'd get a combination I don't prefer.

2) My car looks showroom new. There is no reason why I would get a new car that looks identical in every way.

3) Folks seem to repeatedly conveniently forget that these 08 lease promotions require $3000-$5000 down. You would have to be "out of your mind" to put any money up front on a lease. Even Philippe agrees with that.

4) My payment is going from 1500 to 900 on the same car overnight, without a penny out of pocket. Forgive me if I don't consider that to be a stupid move like some apparently do. Until today I have heard no better cost savings than this.

5) Box: I don't want an M6. I don't want a convertible. They're ugly with the top up.

6) I don't want to start an 08 lease and be stuck in it for three years when I can do a loan and sell it at any time I want.

7) If I switch to a loan, I can keep a car I love, sell it anytime I want, and enjoy the new look and body style of an 09 when I feel I can afford it.

So as you can see, I have thought this through. I'm hardly "out of my mind".

Keep something in mind: just because I don't always respond to everything everyone says, and spell out in detail why I do or don't agree, doesn't mean I'm ignoring your input, rejecting it, or am too dumb to "get it". There are details I have to consider that you won't always be privy to. So I ask my pointed question, hope for a straight answer, appreciate very much the input, and sign off to continue my deliberations.

-N-

[boxboss]

So why am I having to pay for the certification process at all? And why am I having to pay for any repairs it needs?

Your request that the car be a CPO is the reason for the expense and that is why you should pay for it.

In this scenario, you are the one making the choice to CPO the vehicle to get the benefit of the rates/service.

Bdaw - thank you for the first helpful response in this thread. Actually addressing the question and sans any snarky commentary.
Sorry I wasn't more helpful regarding your question and am very glad bdaw did.

You choose not to listen to our advice, and that's fine. You want the special CPO rate, but the $2500 CPO cost alone (excluding repairs) will add $65/month to your payment (assuming a 3 year note.) On a $900/month note, that's an effective interest rate addition of 7%. So, your desire to get the promo rate of what, 1.9%?, will cost you upwards of 9% (excluding repairs) in effective interest. Not much of a deal, is it?

I do know your situation - you want to drive a 6 series for the least amount possible. If that's not it, it should be. WTF do I know anyway? I'm driving a new M6 cabrio for about what you're going to drive a 3 year old 650 with significant miles for.

[dk38]

I'm driving a new M6 cabrio for about what you're going to drive a 3 year old 650 with significant miles for.

Don't mean to hijack the thread but I still can't believe the deal you and M6D(Redneck/etc/etc) got :thumb: :woot: